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Take a simple example like the pendulum with a moving support (But only considering the pendulum mass $m$, not the support mass $M$): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_mechanics#/media/File:PendulumWithMovableSupport.svg

From my understanding I could formulate the Lagrangian for the moving reference frame from the perspective of an observer sitting on the support. Using the pendulum angle $\theta$ as the only coordinate and considering only the velocity relative to the moving reference frame. $r$ is the length of the pendulum. With $L=T-V$ ($T$ for kinetic, $V$ for potential energy, $Q$ for generalized forces not included in the energy) I end up with:

$$ \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}t} \frac{\partial L}{\partial \dot{\theta}} - \frac{\partial L}{\partial \theta} - Q = m r^2 \ddot{\theta} + m g r \sin \theta - Q = 0 $$ With the acceleration of the frame $\ddot{x}$ and the position vector of m, $\mathbf{r}$ I can add the only additional force: $$ Q = \frac{\partial \mathbf{r}}{\partial \theta} \cdot \ddot{x} (-1, 0) = - m \ddot{x} r \cos \theta $$ So I can eliminate $m$ and $r$ and get: $$ r \ddot{\theta} + g \sin \theta + \ddot{x} \cos \theta = 0 $$ Which is the same solution as wikipedia gives for the moving pendulum.

So far, all examples I've seen considered a moving reference frame by adding the relative speed to an inertial reference frame in the system's kinetic energy. As I understand it, I can just as well look at all movements relative to the moving frame and view the acceleration from 'outside' as an extra force. Which in some cases might make the algebraic stuff easier, I think.

Am I just lucky in this case and making wrong assumptions or is this a valid way to get to the equations of motion?

Qmechanic
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bobribar
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2 Answers2

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Start with the position vector to the mass

$$\vec R=\left[ \begin {array}{c} x \left( \tau \right) +l\sin \left( \varphi \right) \\ l\cos \left( \varphi \right) \end {array} \right] $$

where $~x(\tau)~$ is known.

from here you obtain the kinetic and potential energy and with EL the equation of motion

$$ \ddot\varphi-{\frac {-g\sin \left( \varphi \right) + \left( {\frac {d^{2}}{d{\tau }^{2}}}x \left( \tau \right) \right) \cos \left( \varphi \right) }{l }} =0$$

where dot is $~\frac{d}{d\tau}~$


the kinetic energy $~T~$ is a function of $~\dot x~,\dot\varphi~,\varphi$

Eli
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Seems like I didn't make a mistake, it works out for other examples too and this link https://galileoandeinstein.phys.virginia.edu/7010/CM_28_Non_Inertial_Frame_Coriolis.pdf answers the question also this way. It's much easier in a lot of examples to add the fictitious forces later and to not consider the movement of the frame in the kinetic energy.

bobribar
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