The manual for my 2003 VW TDI says to change the oil every 12 months or 10,000 miles. My dealer says every 6 months or 5,000 miles.
Are they just trying to make twice as much money off my oil changes, or is there a legitimate reason to change the oil twice as often as VW originally printed in the book?
Hi I'm a VAG mechanic 20 years experience, all the TDI engines need to be serviced every 30.000 KM if you are using 5w30 iso 500 to 504. DSG every 60.000 KM. Fuel filter, air filter, and cabin filter also 60.000 KM or 2 years. Its your choice if you want to pay us more. Most of my customers have more of 600.000 KM on tacho.
To a certain extent it depends on the type of usage you do, but for an average driver doing average miles (i.e. a mixture of highway, country and urban driving), I'd say to stick with the manufacturer's recommendation - but make sure you also stick to the recommended specification of oil.
Remember that oil technologies and manufacturing tolerances have improved massively over the last 20 years or so, meaning that services don't need to be as frequent as they used to.
Personally, I wouldn't take a car of that age to a main dealer, once it's got the the age when keeping a full service history is no longer important, I'd go with a small independant or do it myself...
If your TDI is a PD type then you're better off erring on the short/fast side. There were many cases of prematurely worn out cams on PDs due to oil. This means sticking to the oil norm and change interval specified by VW.
If the engine is a non-PD TDI (such as ALH, AFN etc.) then you could try using oil analyzer (such as lubricheck) in order to determine the level of oil wearing. This can be done at the end of the usage cycle or even during use.
For example, in my common rail TDI I used to change the oil at 15.000 km but upon analyzing the oil quality I am going to bump this up to 20.000 km (90% city driving but at unusual hours - almost no stop-and-go traffic).
In a TDI, in general, its advisable to not cut costs on oil and fuel. Use the best that you can find, it's better and, in the long run, it's cheaper.
Being as they are a Volkswagen dealer, they should be using oil that conforms to 504.00 or more likely 507.00 standard oil. The details of this are discussed in this official Volkswagen document. Furthermore, your vehicles owners handbook is very clear about the regularity with which the oil should be changed.
I personally have a collection of Volkswagens which include two TDI engined cars; a 1.9 PD and a 1.6 Bluemotion. Both of which have oil changes around to 10,000 mile mark.
New cars actually require much less frequent oil changes than the 3,000 mile interval we are all used to. For your specific vehicle you will want to refer to your owner’s manual for the exact oil change schedule, however many new vehicles only require an oil change every 7,500 to 10,000 miles.
I have a 2003 VW Jetta TDI. I also own a 99.5 and two 2002. They all use the ALH engine. I work on other's cars, and most of them are ALH engines. My four cars have over 1.5 million miles on them.
I use T6 5w40 oil, and have used it in all my cars since they were new. I change at the 10k mile point, with a new filter each time. Oil analysis (sporadic) says the oil is still OK at that point. I have no experienced engine failure or excessive wear due to oil failure.
The only exception is that because we get cold temperatures for about two months of the year (below 0F), I change out the oil even if it has only 4k miles on it, in late December or the first week of January. This is done to help starting in the wintertime, when the cars get cold soaked overnight with temperatures below 0F. Generally, they start fine at -15F, if the oil is clean.
With a diesel engine the particulate deposition in the oil is much more significant than with a gasser. A normal load of particulates can render oil in a diesel engine to be a much higher viscosity at colder temperatures than at warmer ones. For example the VW TDI engine will readily start at -15F without a block heater or other starting aids. But with dirtier oil, starting at -15F can be problematic even using 0W30 oil. The problem is that the viscosity increase is non-linear at colder temperatures and the effect of particulates is also non-linear. With clean oil I have started VW TDI at -30F without starting aids. Below that temperature even a new group 95 battery will not put out enough power to start a cold engine. (For -40F with a TDI one needs to pull the battery and keep it inside for reliable starting, or have a block heater, booster or other starting aids.)
So from my limited empirical experience, I would suggest that a 10k mile interval is fine. However, if you have allot of city driving, or dusty conditions, you may wish to go with a more frequent change. Otherwise, there is no advantage to much more frequent oil changes, particularly with oil analysis confirming that your oil remains in good condition at 10k miles.
Note: The ALH, on the 2003, uses the VE pump, not the PD.
The simple and best answer is when your car tells you to go to service (with service indicator message). Many VW vehicles produced since 2000 are capable of smart service intervals. The vehicles which do not support this feature uses fixed service intervals which assume worst driving conditions. This means service indicator appears with minimum usage. (more often oil changes than smart service interval vehicles).
You have to read SSP 224 to fully understand this concept. However I tried to summarize it below for the impatient.
VW vehicles equipped with smart service sensors are found more often in Europe. Vehicles sold in America got sensors later as American consumer seem to change oil more often. By not supplying sensors, VW could reduce costs. There are many reasons why consumers in America change oil so often which is outside the scope of this question, therefore I won't get into it.
You need to make sure that you are using an oil which satisfies 504.00/507.00 and the flexible service intervals is enabled in your vehicle computer. It can be enabled in vehicles produced after 2000. The vehicle computer monitors driving conditions and determine when the oil should be changed. So no guesswork is needed for figuring out how often it should be done.
You can find the detailed explanation at the official VW self study documentation SSP 224
No more guesswork is required. No more worrying about making frequent short trips or living in a harsh weather environment requiring more often oil changes. No more being trapped by auto workshops scaring you to upsell frequent oil changes.
The vehicle computer continuously adjust the required service time by tracking the oil level, oil temperature, brake sensor, needle lift sensitive, driven distance per drive etc.
Unfortunately VW seem to have made a mistake in naming scheme. Because it is called flexible service interval and it require using 504.00/507.00 long life oil. Many people incorrectly use the term long oil change interval, and therefore does not understand that car actually monitor usage (therefore fear it). In reality it is a smart change interval where the car computer tracks exactly how the car is driven and tells the driver exactly right time to change the oil.
I think it depends what type of oil you use. Synthetic can go longer between changes because it doesn't have viscosity modifiers that breakdown. For instance 5w-30 dyno oil is actually 5w oil with viscosity modifiers to make it act like 30 when hot. As the oil is churned about inside the engine, the modifiers break down until you're left with 5w oil that acts like 5w oil when hot (not good). Synthetic oil is different. The base stock of the oil is 5w-30 and doesn't break down to 5w with use, so you can go much longer between changes.
Synthetic oils are a whole different story. There is no VI improver added so there is nothing to wear out. The actual oil molecules never wear out. You could almost use the same oil forever. The problem is that there are other additives and they do get used up. I suppose if there was a good way to keep oil clean you could just add a can of additives every 6 months and just change the filter, never changing the oil.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-102/
I have seen several car owner manuals that are now stating that oils do not need to be changed but every 7,500 miles or more. The same manual also states OR every 12 months, whichever occurs first. My feeling is that you can probably go 5,000 miles on the average (in a sports car) but you must change your oil in the spring time at a minimum, particularly up north. Oils form waxes in icy cold weather. There is a permanent thickening of the oil.
Some automotive manufacturers are backing down on oil change intervals to 5,000 miles or less and some advocate changing the oil at least every 6 months as well. I think this is because of the tendency for oils to thicken in very hot engines (not ambient conditions, just hot engines). Also because of thickening from the cold of winter and from sludge build up that cannot be filtered out.
Not every dealer is trying to squeeze you for every cent they can although some certainly are. Giving the dealer the benefit of the doubt, ask them why they think you should change it more often. It is possible they are looking at the miles you drive compared to the average and assuming you drive short trips which are particularly tough on diesels and need to change oil more frequently or that your oil looks especially dirty. If they can,t give you answer then follow the recommended guideline. Make sure you check the oil level regularly.
2013 Passat TDI. Have an oil analysis done and quit speculating. I change at 8.5 to 9k as that is when the additive package was low on my last analysis.
